"Gimmicks?"

[maxwellchris]

Maybe I need to re-read my rulebook (and I do), but I'm wondering if there's any "official" way to handle characters that I would call "Gimmicks;" those who are basically Fighters or Mystery Men, but they also rely heavily (and are themed around) a single power or piece of high-tech equipment?  Like, could you make the Golden Age Sandman using the core rules?  I'll post more examples of what I'm asking about here later, but that should get things started

[Adminenkainen]

If you're looking for the "official" answer...

There are two ways to build a "gimmick" hero. Okay, maybe three.

A hero with a single gimmick -- let's use the Sandman as our example -- starts out with a trophy weapon (a gas gun or a wirepoon gun, depending on when this particular hero is starting from). The Editor is generally discouraged from giving out trophy weapons during character creation, but in a solo campaign I can see that being more okay.

Or, the hero takes a level in magic-user or superhero so he can have a spell or power that duplicates that gimmick (sleep, or wall-climbing). Then the fact that a gimmick gun is causing that effect is just flavor text.

Lastly, and I can't see this being as popular, but you could make a character who's schtick is gimmicks built entirely from flavor text. He's always carrying gizmos that he can describe in great detail, but they are always the wrong item for the matter at hand. ("I've got a remote-control corkscrew!" "That's great, but what we asked was if you had lockpicks!")

[order99]

Well, we have rules for 'Gimmicks' in H&H 1st Edition Book III, Page 30:

INVENTING AND MAGICAL RESEARCH
Fighters and Superheroes may attempt to invent devices that duplicate
existing powers or spells, or develop new ones. Magic-Users may attempt
to create new spells. Both require time and money. If new, the Editor will
determine the power or spell level of the desired effect. For 1 st level, a new
power or spell requires 1 week and $2,000. For 2 nd level, a new power or
spell requires 2 weeks and $4,000. Meeting these requirements gives a
20% chance of success, cumulative with additional, equal investments.
Devices invented that duplicate powers or spells (either preexisting or
otherwise) will have a 100% chance of working correctly once, but will drop each additional time the device is used and, once a roll fails, the
device will never work properly again. A failed device can be rebuilt, but
the invention process outlined above must be restarted from scratch.
Spells invented are permanently usable. Magic-Users are assumed to
have spell books, one for each spell level, to which new spells will be
added. Making a duplicate set of spell books requires the same investiture
of time and money as magical research, but with a 100% chance of
success.

Please note that under these rules Gimmicks will only be reliable about 3-4 times per comic (and would probably be considered Major Trophies).

In 2nd Edition I don't see any similar rules-nor can Magic-Users research their own spell-but if a Hero has time and money I don't see any reason that the Editor can't just have the Hero roll a '6' on a Skill Check, spend the money and eventually get a Trophy (1D6 roll per week of research plus the money, 1 '6'= Lvl of Spell/Power,keep the '6's week after week until getting the desired result etc). Note that Major Trophies and Spells will easily bankrupt your average PC, and that Mysterymen make great inventors(Stunts=Success for the week, Money still spent of course).

Now Minor Trophies? Some of them are just normal Tech for the period-and they have a price tag! Some of these could well just be Equipment....

Option One: Can our Imitation Sandman afford a few Smoke Bombs at Lvl 1? Probably! A Gas Mask at $400.00 would be out of the ballpark, but a Rebreather is only $75.00, so the Editor lets the PC have it. After enough Adventures, Dr Somnus ( Human Mysteryman)counts his money, sequesters himself at the lab spends a Stunt and has a Sleep Gun, good for a few reliable uses per comic and often subject to expensive rebuilding...

Option Two: Dr Somnus styles himself as a 'Science Hero' but is actually a Magic User rebranded. The Editor uses 'Editorial Fiat' to indicate Dr Somnus cannot engage or be engaged in a Contest of Wills (or use other MU Spells) nor can he recharge his powers without a lab...but allows Dr. Somnus to recharge his powers every 8 hours instead of 12 as a compensation. Our hero's Wand is his Omni-pistol with five Formula (Int 16) known (Sleep, Charm('hypno-mist') Protection From Evil(a mix of Holy Water, Silver and Iron suspension) Light (phosphor-gas) and Remove Fear(Adrenal Injector). Due to the limitations of his Tech, Dr Somnus can only carry two of the bulky magazines on his person at a time and can only use the gun once until it has been recharged...but as the tech is better developed (Our Hero gains Levels) the gun becomes capable of discharging more often and the Magazines become sleeker and easier to carry! During Issue #1 of 'Journey Into Danger" Our Hero puchases a $75.00 Rebreather using his Military SCM and Editor permission, sews it into his mask and Dr Somnus is as ready as he'll ever be! Dr Somnus can keep advancing as a Science Hero and become less of a Sandman knockoff as he advances, or decide he has enough Signature Gizmos and Multi-class into MysteryMan and remain Wesley Dodd's imitator...

Option Three: The Retarius (aka Herbert Lake, "The Man With The Cavorite Heart!") Retarius is built as a 1st Edition Android Superhero, but is a man in an armored suit. He has his Tech Recognition abilities from his stay as a prisoner of the DeRo, and the Cavorite Micro-reactor installed by his sister (SCM) floods his system and allows his Leaping Abilities and Android Save Bonuses in normal Human form. The other half of his "body" however, gives him his True Strength and Wreck at Range abilities plus any further powers he develops and his enhanced AC-all in his suit. He heals as fast as a normal man, but half his Hit Points are in his suit and do not heal at all without repair. His Weakness (failed Saves vs Mind or Emotion Control results in complete shutdown instead-a Safety to keep him from ever being a toll of the DeRo again) works in or out of his suit. The Retarius is now ready for Issue #1 of "Adventure Carousel Presents!".

Option Four: Susan Dyer wants to be a cross between the Green Hornet and Hawkwoman. She is a Lvl 1 Human Fighter. She wants to start with Wings. The Editor states that for $400.00 she can have a re-named Spring-loaded Shoes, letting her cover half a football field with a running leap. Alas, Susan does not have that starting cash, so the Editor asks how it fits into her Origin Story(she makes her free SCM a stranded Alien and the Flying Suit cobbled from a damaged Gravity Module) so the Editor lets her have the Flying Suit for only $100.00-and ups the Failure Rate from 1% to 5% (EEP!) With just enough ammo for her Gun and an unstable prototype Wing Harness, Gyrfalcon is ready for Issue #1 of "Crime Does Not Work!". With the addition of most of Susan's money being funneled to her SCM and the Editor periodically rolling dice behind the screen and making notes, Gyrfalcon at Lvl 4 has a Wingsuit with the following features:

All The Bugs Out (back to 1% Failure Rate)
Gravity Chute (Feather Fall 1/Day)
Advanced Alloys (AC 7/Bulletproof)
Overthrust Pack (Leap I 1/Day)


Oh and BTW, Gadgets need not be high-tech...Luminous Paint, Grappling Hooks, Flack Jackets, Firecrackers, Pepper Pots, and Weapons are all in the regular Equipment list-Tear Gas guns may be pricey but small sealed packets of cayenne pepper? A bag of Flour and a Firecracker make great (if hazardous!) Smoke bombs! Disable the Getaway car with a carrot up the exhaust and a box of nails under each tire!

And BTW, a lot of those Comic Books Heroes with Gimmicks? Most of those seem to have Brevet Ranks (especially the MUs). But you can get pretty close even at Lvl 1 I think, with just a bit of creativity...

[Adminenkainen]

Wonderfully done, Order!

I've never been satisfied with my inventing things rules, so I didn't bring those up.

Allowing starting heroes to buy minor trophies is thinking outside the box, but if an Editor wants to allow that, go for it!

[maxwellchris]

Wow! I appreciate all the feedback, and will be digesting all of it....now! Again, thanks!

[order99]

Just remember maxwellchris, H&H is about the game effects, not the powers. Is your Wreck at Range a Disintegration Beam(that doesn't affect living tissue) an Acid Spray(that misses you but melts your gun, or a Gravity Wave? Do you Raise Elephant with your raw Strength, running under it at Superspeed and creating a tornado? Shapeshift into a hydraulic jack? Doesn't matter, just pick a theme for flavor and handwave it!

Now very recently, Our Esteemed Editor read Feature Comics and decided that Dollman's 'shrinking ability' was nothing more than flavor text:

hnhlexicon.blogspot.com/2020/08/feature-comics-30-pt-2.html

-and I don't see why not...if it doesn't have a game effect, it's flavor text. In a similar vein, let's say I want an Invisible Man-his Schtick is that he is 'always' Invisible. Well, assuming I have the power or spell of Invisibility (or Ring) I am Actually Invisible and it has a Game Effect-sometimes. The rest of the time though I am 'virtually' Invisible-if I fail my Skill Roll while sneaking around then I have made a noise, knocked something over, am outlined in Cigar smoke, detected by scent etc, and if I am detected the Bad Guys always seem to know to aim at my Dialogue Balloon or home in on my noisy shoes or coat me in flour etc. In fact, 'being Invisible' might just be my Secret ID/Costume! Picture a Mysteryman(decent Skill checks,Stunts for those 'perfect Ninja' moments) wearing a 'belt of Invisibility'(Bulletproof Vest)Signature Move=Invisible Tap on the Shoulder(goes last)-literally no more powerful than any other Mysteryman, but...more UNIQUE.

Now, if I as Player wanted to play a Doll-man Expy and wanted some game effects to match, I could easily make Tanya Tremaine (aka THE TOY) a Half-Alien, pick Shrinking as her Racial Ability,have a Bullpen Session with my Editor to determine the Effects (AC as Flack Jacket, +1 to Hide, no human-sized Weapons/Equipment while shrunk). The Editor agrees that the effect is no better than an extra SCM or a Movement and Leaping increase would be, I decide that The Toy is a Mysterywoman, her Signature Move is Full-Sized Punch (lose Shrink benefit for the Combat Round) and...i'm done! In Toy form, Tanya covers less ground in her tiny form (Virtual Encumbrance as Flack Jacket) is limited to 1D3 Unarmed Damage (and while I could throw small objects such as pennies or marbles they won't really do more than annoy targets)and is harder to hit and harder to see...hardly unbalancing compared to her companions (Fighter with Flack Jacket and Shotgun, MU with Wand and Regular Mysteryman with a Trained Bloodhound SCM and a Bulletproof Vest). On the other hand,they can't use a 5-cent's worth of Fishing line and a fishhook to climb walls either, heh heh... With this same philosophy, that MU can do Magic anytime he wants-as long as it has no Game Effect.Pulling a coin out of someone's ear or making smoke come out of your fingers or making your cane bend like rubber may be supernatural, but entertaining children or intimidating a foe or distracting a mark or impressing a date with them is a Skill check.And lighting your Cigar with your finger? Flavor text.

Other Examples:

HAWKMAN (my version, no Brevet Ranks Allowed) Carter Hall, Half-Alien Fighter. Powers-Long Jump, +1 Spot Hidden (I can't take 'extra SCM' because that's the only Power Humans have, so I downgrade using H&H 1st Ed, as my guide...Humans started with two skills, Hide and Spot Hidden in that version).

Equipment-Wings (I actually buy Brass Knuckles and a Superhero Costume-my Wings provide benefits of both and therefore I have my Cost benchmark.Later, I will buy a Bulletproof Vest and call it a Wings Upgrade). I also buy other weapons (at least a Lasso at first) because Hawkman used those things. Hawkman is a Fighter with an agile, mobile fighting style and probably won't wear heavier armor.

In the Meantime though, 18' is just enough 'Flight' to swoop down up unsuspecting criminals, Swoop off-panel and reach a second-story roof-and by Level 4 I can "Fly' up to three Stories up or down and cover half a Football field at once-and if pushed off the roof a Skill check might (Editor Call) turn that Fall into a Controlled Landing...

Most Fighters Dodge bullets, Superheroes Bounce them, I Deflect them with my Wings-it's the same Save Vs Bullets anyway you cut it.

Now, much later in the Campaign the Editor may smile upon me and let my endless research yield a Flight gimmick with (un)reliable usage...or maybe a magic Fight Ring or something-or maybe Hawkman Multi-classes into Magic User (Wand=Emblem on wing harness) taking Feather Fall, Healing and Divination-type and Utility-type spells, Flight much later,maybe Haste, etc). But even without any of that, the Rules as written get me a 'close enough' Hawkman just by interpreting how the Game Effects look 'in-panel'.

THE RED BEE (Mysteryman, No Brevet Ranks)

Race: Human. Power-Extra Starting SCM 'Swarm of Trained Bees'

Equipment-Utterly Ridiculous Costume (as Superhero Outfit) with a buzzing belt buckle (Michael the Bee)
Signature Move-Obscured by Bees(delays Initiative to match SCM's).
(No one said that SCMs had to be people.And that Bee Swarm can lose Morale just like a person and refuse to scout or fight).


Our Esteemed Editor Scott has always envisioned Hourman as a Superhero (with Miraclo as a Special Effect). I always envisioned Rex Tyler as an Alter Ego from the Trophy Case (Fighter to Superhero, Miraclo, one hour). But if some other Editor somewhere wants to make him a Mysteryman, penalize both Starting Money and Rewards by 50% (Miraclo Production Tax) and give him the Gimmick Miraclo (Giant Strength, Bulletproof Vest,+5 Move, 30' Leap) at Lvl 1...well, it's not technically wrong, and the power boost he gets at Lvl 1 will be no better at Lvl 6.

Hoodlums and Hideouts is really, really, really flexible that way.It's why i'm so glad I found this game.

[Adminenkainen]

I'd be sold now even if I wasn't already biased!

[maxwellchris]

Hello Order99! I agree that H&H does not need to be turned into a "kitchen sink supers" game that has a defined individual power for everything, but...Hawkman can fly. If I'm playing Hawkman, I want him to fly, not "leap 18 feet." The more I think about this, while your approach is creatively interesting, the more I'm leaning toward creating a "Gimmick" class of my own, which would allow the hero to have single defined Power at Level 1 (no freestyle selection like Superheroes get), with a limited number of uses (other than flavor text uses), and with the understanding that the "Power" generally comes from a device of some kind, etc. Just seems like less work, and lets Hawkman actually "Fly"right away, like he would have been able to. The "Wings" device could then further be defined as having the qualities you mentioned (armor, brass knuckles, etc), which would be another part of the creation of the device that each Gimmick uses. Anyway, that's just where my thoughts are drifting

[Adminenkainen]

I've always given Hawkman trophy item wings...but then, I'll confess I've never tried to build him from 1st level.

[order99]

Nov 5, 2020 20:18:28 GMT maxwellchris said:

Hello Order99! I agree that H&H does not need to be turned into a "kitchen sink supers" game that has a defined individual power for everything, but...Hawkman can fly. If I'm playing Hawkman, I want him to fly, not "leap 18 feet." The more I think about this, while your approach is creatively interesting, the more I'm leaning toward creating a "Gimmick" class of my own, which would allow the hero to have single defined Power at Level 1 (no freestyle selection like Superheroes get), with a limited number of uses (other than flavor text uses), and with the understanding that the "Power" generally comes from a device of some kind, etc. Just seems like less work, and lets Hawkman actually "Fly"right away, like he would have been able to. The "Wings" device could then further be defined as having the qualities you mentioned (armor, brass knuckles, etc), which would be another part of the creation of the device that each Gimmick uses. Anyway, that's just where my thoughts are drifting

  I completely agree-I'm just having fun seeing what I can do within the Rules As Written before I make up new ones.

 The more I think about it though, I think a 'Gimmick Hero' might be a fun addition. I was toying with 'Science Hero' ( see Dr Somnus previously) by rebranding and Tweaking the M-U...Likewise i'm considering a 'Mystic Hero' type (narrower number of powers 'known' like a M-U, limted slots like a Superhero, but can choose off of both lists...

 Another, simpler method of making a Gadgeteer might be to multiply Starting Funds by three (and re-roll '1's) and let the PC pick anything out of the equipment and Trophy lists, with leftover funds over $50.00 vanishing before play. Add that ability to a Mysteryman instead of Signature Move, keep the Skills Saves and 'to-hit' rolls, turn  "Stunts" into "Omni-gadgets" (one-time Instant Equipment of $100.00 or less you just 'happened' to have) and you have a Class that starts out a little more powerful at the beginning but won't get much better in combat (no Signature Move)...

  Now if I just wanted a Hawkman  character, and he absolutely had to fly at Lvl 1...i'd have a Bullpen Session with the Editor:

-Fly is a Lvl 3 Spell or a Lvl 2 Power-one lasts longer, the other has better speed. Potent ability for a Lvl 1 PC

-The most powerful Race in H&H would probably be the Alien, with two increasingly potent Movement powers and an increasingly effective Defensive ability Hence a weakness listed. (Androids have plenty going for them too, but the Abilities don't increase with Level in 2nd Edition)

-The biggest bang for the biggest buck then, would be to make Carter Hall an Alien ('re-incarnated). This would also explain his Golden Age preference for ancient weaponry and older cultures

-The Editor agrees to trade in all three normal Alien abilities for one really potent one... Flight, 12" +2" per Level. Your  Hawkman can now Fly a little faster than he can run, 'sprint' through the air with a Skill check, and get faster with experience

-Weakness is that all powers are in the Ninth-metal wing harness and can be disabled or taken

 -The harness itself has no game effect other than allowing Hawkman to fly-additional effects such as Better AC would be a modeled by buying a Superhero Costume and a Shield (Carter Hall has always been portrayed as a Fighter Class IMHO..

 So...

Hawkman (Carter Hall)

Alien Fighter

Starting Abilities-Flight at 12"+2"/Lvl

Weakness-Dependent on Ninth-metal flight Harness

Starting Equipment- Ninth Metal Wing Harness (AC 7 "costume +Shield[wings]) and a Mace

 I'd say he's no more potent than Superman at Lvl 1.

 Or for the Super-easy way, just give Carter Hall the Human Fighter a Trophy at Lvl 1, and then give all of the other PC's one as well for balance...and to prevent whining.

 You know, now i'm tempted to make a Pulp Hero Class using the Mysteryman as a base-no Signature Move, no Stunts, keep the rest and give out lots of 'Virtual' money (research funds) to just buy powers using Equipment and Trophies (Green Hornet with a Modified Car and Gas Gun, the Shadow with Elven Cloak etc).  I'll need to mull it over though, and probably place it in a New Thread when I do...

[Adminenkainen]

Always intriguing!

Did I already share that the mystic class -- just like you described -- was slated to go in the Heroes Handbook someday?

[order99]

Nov 8, 2020 3:41:01 GMT Adminenkainen said:

Always intriguing!

Did I already share that the mystic class -- just like you described -- was slated to go in the Heroes Handbook someday?

 Hah, I must have left my Crystal Ball  running the entire night...

 (opens Electric Bill)

 

[maxwellchris]

Hey, folks! Sorry I went MIA...been a little distracted by current “events.” Yeah. Yikes. Anyway, I really appreciate the detailed and considerate responses here! I absolutely will get back on the stick with a Gimmick Hero write up (and one for my Tricksy character in another thread) really soon! Still poring over the 2nd Ed rulebook again, and also: Scott - don’t tease us with mentions of the Handbook like that!

[maxwellchris]

And, Order99: that Pulp Hero sounds pretty great!